Article 7 – Interview with Jasyn Lucas, an Indigenous Artist in Northern Manitoba

Introduction:

Hello, my name is Jasyn Lucas, I live here in Thompson. I graduated here in 1997. I’ve moved to Vancouver for a couple of years, did some art school, now I’m back in Thompson. I’ve been running my own business for about 13 years as a professional artist, an Indigenous artist and painter. I’ve recently come back to University College of the North to continue my studies in Education, to become a better teacher, as I often end up public speaking.

Joseph: I am Joseph Atoyebi, one of the editors of Muses from the North. I have been watching a video about Jasyn and how he gave us his story about himself. I think it’s a very wise, smart move to come and enroll to get a degree in education, because ultimately, we all need something to fall back on. Not only that, you can use your education as a platform to inspire younger people too. I think it’s great.

Ying: I also think that the legacy of Indigenous art could be better carried on if you work with the youth.

Joseph: Yes, indeed.

Ying: As editors of Muses of the North, we are very interested in displaying your artwork and disseminating the stories about your art, especially Northern Culture Indigenous Tradition. That’s why I went to your art exhibition in TRCC (Thompson Recreation and Culture Center) the other day. I saw your art works at the exhibition and were glad that we had a chance to have this interview happen here on campus. We would like to hear you talk about your art, major works, motivation for your art life, and the stories behind your arts, of course.

Joseph: That’s correct. Has Ying shown you some of the art works we published before? Here is the print copy of the issue how we incorporated some student’s artwork in Muses from the North.

Ying: No, I haven’t got the chance to show him yet. After the interview I will do it, but I’m sure I have sent him our link already. I’ve already introduced our journal to him, which is registered with Libraries and Achieves Canada. This journal has both print and digital copies. The digital one reaches into the International readers sooner than the print copy.

Interview:

Ying: Why are you so interested in art? What inspired you to start with your work?

Jasyn: Growing up, I was always painting, I was always drawing. Constantly just doing artwork. I used to give away all of my pictures during recess, and my mom said, “You know what, you have to start charging people.” So, I charged them a quarter in grade two. I started selling my pictures during lunch and recess for a quarter. It eventually moved up to one or two dollars. So, I was selling paintings ever since I was young, I just kept at it. My teachers would say, “Oh, you’re going to be a famous artist one day.” I didn’t know what that meant, but, ultimately, I just kept on that path all through high school, and then I went to art school. I just found out, for me, as I was a lot younger back then, so my ego at the time was like, I just want to work for myself; I’m feeling like I can do this by myself. I don’t want to work for anybody else, so then I did. Then I worked very hard for my business. I travelled all around doing art shows all over Canada, putting my name out there and building those networks, so that now when I travel, I do have those contacts. But, as I got older, further into my career, I opened up an art gallery and tattoo shop, it was very exhausting. The self-realizing moment for me was, I could continue with business the way I’m doing it, or, I can go after some of the other dreams that I do have. I’m doing well with my business, it got to the point where I felt like there was more to my life than just doing nice paintings and doing nice tattoos for people. I felt a lot of the times because you’re catering to people who can afford artwork, that you’re only working with certain classes, or social groups. I felt I was pretty limited to the sorts of people that I really wanted to help out. I found myself often times in conversations where I didn’t have the background or knowledge, the right words to defend people who needed help and who needed help with somebody to stick up for them. So, I decided to go back to school, and I felt that it would really help with my paintings, my artwork, so that I could better communicate my message when I’m talking with youth, or when I’m doing public speaking. Usually, up until the last couple of years, I only focused on landscape and wildlife art. So, very simple, nice kind of landscapes with no political or social content. Because I have to live with it everyday, I chose subjects that were easy, peaceful for me that I could live with everyday and that could bring me joy. In the last few years, I’ve had some really great opportunities to use my art to attack more social and political kind of issues that were important to me, now that my career is a little more established. So, I felt like I could take those risks, and stick up for some people that I wanted to help. In the case of our last show, it was really showcasing the triumphs and the challenges with Indigenous Women, Canadian Women, here in Northern Manitoba, and in Canada in general. But, mainly here in Northern Manitoba. And that was a really awesome, unique position for me because I’m a male, Indigenous role model, and they could have chosen a female, a great female artist to do it, but I was very honored that they chose me. I felt that it was a really great platform, an opportunity for me to spread a message to others, other men that are in this area, and other men that visit this area. That we live and conduct our behaviors in a certain way, and should, that uplifts and recognize the challenges of our women here in the North. That’s what I continue to do with that particular show. I was really happy to be a part of that and I have a feeling that I’ll be doing more shows to kind of address those social issues in the future. My passion really lies now with helping those people who just really need help, to help themselves and find a great balance.
Myself, I am an Indigenous Cree, 100% Cree man, but I was adopted into a European family. I’m an urban Indian, or an urban Indigenous person, who is very much detached from my Indigenous ways. I am starting to learn them now, but, I have the other experience of the urban life and I do have my art school education and different life experiences that I can help to try and bridge the gap between youth who are living on reserve and off reserve, in urban areas, they’re constantly travelling back and forth, they’re being encouraged to go back to traditions, but we also have to be careful that we encourage them also to harness technology and education and have a good balance of both. Not every Indigenous person has access to his home reservation for those traditions. So, a lot of Indigenous youth are unique with customs, they’re different, so they just can’t be under one umbrella statement. We’re also different, so we require different needs.

Ying: I’m glad that you mentioned the dominant male figure to tell the story about female and to show the sympathy. Expressions in art between man and woman is probably different. How do the Indigenous women respond to the artwork that you’ve created?

Jasyn: That particular show was very different for me, most people leave my shows quite joyful. I think most of them left with feelings of joy and hope, but also, there was tears and you could really tell that it tugged at some heart strings in some individuals, because the paintings did have some of those darker points in our history. So, to see their response, I would say they were so thankful, and they’d come and hug me, some couldn’t even talk because they needed to hold themselves up after seeing my artworks.

Joseph: So overwhelmed!

Jasyn: But it felt like I had done my job, as an artist that you know you’ve done your job as an artist when you can see those emotions. That’s for me, really, really special.

Joseph: I know that you mentioned that your work was based on landscape initially, and nature in general. What kind of major themes feature in your work these days?

Jasyn: With that particular show, and the last couple of shows, a lot of the seven sacred grandfather teachings, I use those seven teachings to tie the whole series of paintings together. In this last show there was seven separate paintings. So, each painting had a teaching and then, within that painting I addressed either a certain issue: whether it be residential schools, the impacts of hydro, or things like that so each kind of had a teaching to back up the painting.

Ying: Another thing that you were just talking about is the balance between traditions and modernization, and I think this is the key issue, especially, with education that we encourage students to go back to tradition. In contemporary social contexts, we also need new technology to promote Indigenous culture because new devices and apps are coming into market everyday. In your paintings, how can you present those conflicts?

Jasyn: That’s a really good question. I think in one painting, I had a picture of the tree of life, and the beaver, it was a symbol of wisdom. They were bringing medicine to the tree of life and the tree of life where all emergency workers, you could tell that they’re both modern and traditional. There’s a medicine man, but there’s also a nurse and a doctor. So, I tried to put the two in the same painting, and there’s a little bit of tension there because it looks odd. We’re not used to seeing those two together. But, there’s no right or wrong way to do it, and I knew I just had to do it. You know what, we have to appreciate both of those approaches and applications. Because often, European medicine will work in some cases, and vice versa. Sometimes you have to refer to the traditional cases. We do have to have some sort of trust in each other and be open to that sort of dialogue. We’re getting there, that’s starting to happen. Applying that a little bit more in my artwork and finding a way to do that, I think, is part of the next challenge. Because I haven’t done much in the past. Now that I’m in a position where I’m established, I can take those risks, and I’ll definitely try and find creative ways to do that.

Ying: That’s a really good analogy that you put a Western doctor and a medicine man on the same platform, so that we could see how modernism and tradition merge into each other. I also think that going back to university and having yourself well equipped with new technology and ideas is a recharging process for you. You will be in a better position to revive your tradition, enhance your culture. And I think even the way that we are conducting this interview is to keep the oral tradition. And then we publish the interview. Technology plays a role in both print and digital publications. In today’s world you probably can’t say that I’m going to stay with my tradition while rejecting technology.

Jasyn: I think that’s the challenge that I’m finding right now. The world’s pretty emotional right now, so they’re very sensitive. So to tell them to do one thing, they almost take it bitterly, and there needs to be room for that grey area.

Joseph: So normally, do you draw or paint? What material do you use for your paintings? Canvas or some other material?

Jasyn: I do acrylic painting on canvas. I usually do Northern Lights, I do a lot of Northern Lights, which represent our ancestors. I’m not doing them just because of the color. But I do use an air brush when I’m doing my Northern Lights, I also use hand painting techniques. Again, when I’m working with the kids, I tell them to take advantage of the technology, but also the traditional application in hand painting.

Joseph: How do we convert your work to fit in our online platform? How do we convert to paper form something that we can publish in our journal? We have a webmaster to upload and set up the webpage and all that. How easy do you think it will be for us to manage?

Jasyn: I think when Ying approached me at the show, there are seven really great paintings there that I can double check with T.O.A.S (Thompson Urban Aboriginal Strategy) and if I could email you those images, and the work ups that we have, you could have the exact work ups that we have. You could have the exact write ups and everything. I think that would be good, something at least that they can go through, there’s tons of information and history, and all the extra stuff that you got through this interview.

Ying: We have two special issues dedicated to our local artists/writers, especially with Indigenous background. A good plan is that we can get the first issue to be more about the artist himself, to get our readers to know who you are before they are exposed to your art. Then the second issue will cover some of the art and the story behind it. In this case we can also have a theme to follow: the first issue is the life of the artist, and the second issue is the art and the story. We don’t have to put both into one issue. What do you think?

Joseph: I’m just thinking that if we do the part of the life of the artist, so are we going to include some of the paintings in there?

Ying: I think that some of the paintings could tell the story of an artist.

Joseph: Okay.

Ying: The story Jasyn told about his early art career was very fascinating, starting with commercial awareness at an early age. But then going back to contribute your art to change the society in your adulthood. You mentioned that you were adopted by a European family. Which of your mothers advised you to sell your artworks, your adoptive or birth mom?

Jasyn: My adoptive mom.

Ying: How did that influence your life? I know that Tomson Highway was also adopted by a European family, and we can also see that his work is mainly on Indigenous Literature and Indigenous culture. There’s also European influences in his works. So, how would you comment on your life in that respect? Is it too private for you to talk about?

Jasyn: No, it’s not a problem. I think what I can do is to send you a few pictures of some recent or older work, separate from this show. I’ll send you an artist biography that will have a picture of my face to give just a general bio. Then I’ll give you an artist statement. My latest statement, up to date, about why I’m doing what I’m going to do. Really simple, artist bio page, with artist statement. Maybe 3-5 photos and a good picture photo. I can email those to you. I think that would be a great start.

Ying and Joseph: Excellent!

Ying: Sometimes it is the life stories that force the readers to look into the artist’s work. We will show our readers how your arts reflect the seven teachings. I think, in that case, we would like you to tell us more about art school: where did you go? And how does that education help you to become the artist you are today?

Jasyn: I went to North Vancouver in 1999, attended a studio art program at Capilano College in North Vancouver. I went there for two years, then came back to Thompson for one year to teach graphic arts at the high school. I wasn’t a certified teacher, but they really needed someone like me. They knew my art background, so I pulled it off miraculously. Then I went back to Vancouver to finish my studio art program and graduated from that. I moved back to Thompson and I started up my own business and I started travelling. So, I take my paintings literally to Vancouver, Toronto, Thunder Bay, Edmonton. I do festivals, fairs, Pow Wows, conferences, anything I can. I showcased the Vancouver 2010 Olympics, the world art market, the B.C and Vancouver showcase. I’ve definitely been around a lot with my art. The only person that did that was me. I went out and did it.

Ying: Yes. I think that your travels with your art and your presence at festivals and art shows speak louder for you and your art. Do you have any photos, or anything that could show us about the artist’s life and how it’s been? We would like to include them in the story, such as how you keep your focus on Indigenous teachings through art.

Jasyn: It’s the physical health and well-being of our Indigenous youth, both on-reserve and off-reserve. Mainly on-reserve, and the bad thing about it is the increased youth population in growth rate, but it doesn’t match the funding that’s coming in from the federal government. So, population is increasing, but the funds aren’t increasing. Those things like, eczema, scabies, lice, pinworm, parasites, because of those poor living conditions, can only be treated through European medicines when you come into Thompson. But, then you go back to your community and become re-infested because the problems is not being dealt with. No matter how frustrating it is to be a child, to want to go to school, he wants to have an education, but he’s itchy. Or he’s embarrassed because he has odor, because of water, or humiliated because of his itchy anus, because he has pinworms. That sort of stuff is de-humanizing, humiliating, it makes it really tough for you to go to school. So, it seems almost like, why is this even happening? This has been going on forever, I don’t know why, but I’m starting to go… as I’m sitting there doing tattoos or painting by myself, and going, “I’m not reaching the people I want to reach. Not working with the people I want to work with, and not helping people. Yeah, I can make $1000.00 doing a tattoo, but, I’m sitting with somebody who can afford a tattoo, but doesn’t give a shit about it, that’s why. The physical health and well-being of our youth that maybe want to come and get away from the rez, and the addictions, and that stuff, and give them a good go at the city, and then they have the same problems in the city. Then they end up of course in the justice system, and that’s a whole other story.

Ying: I think you relate to the injustices, the poverty which few artists do. But that’s basically some of the motivations to bring those issues to art. What is the effect of art with this kind of Indigenous issues on Indigenous and non-Indigenous people? Do people become sad, emotional or defiant for these problems? Do people get a push power to stand up for the Indigenous people and fight for a better life?

Jasyn: For me, because it’s relatively new, attacking more of these serious issues that I’ve always just had these battles in my head, that’s why I came back to school to sort those things out so I’m better equipped to do that, and don’t let my emotions get carried away. When people view it, and go through those same emotions, I’m better equipped to know why I painted them, why it is.

Ying: So you give more interpretation to the issues or in the end to find solutions to the issues.

Jasyn: Yeah.

Ying: And I see why after a successful career you decided to go back to school. It’s not only to re-charge, I think it’s also to express yourself.

**1 minute of muffled sound here…

Jasyn: It’s nice when you’re learning of those issues and have to express yourself that the audience around you is there to support you, rather than to go, “Oh, that’s old news.” You know, I’m over it. So, a lot of people, a lot of these issues are 30-50 years old. But if you’re a young kid and just learning about it for the first time, you need a chance to be upset. A chance to kind of let your emotions out and be heard. I think, as much as I’ve grown as an artist, I’m still growing, that’s a really important moment for me to go, “Wow. Now I can get better at it.” It is tough.

Joseph: Who do you consider as your mentor?

Jasyn: My mentor artistically, as a visual artist growing up, it was Robert Bateman of course (Famous Canadian). Still a famous Canadian wildlife artist. Also love some of the local artists around the North like Earl Mckay, Jeff Manias, Theresa Burrows. Lately, (I’m also a song writer/musician) so, my favorite is Leonard Cohen, a Canadian Poet and Writer, and musician. I find his experience a lot of the right material. Everything that he’s travelled to, or battled through, to acquire himself is inspiring. The words that he has to go along with are just beautiful. I’d have to say Leonard Cohen puts me in a nice spot.

Ying: Thanks a lot, Jasyn, for sharing your life’s story with us. I’m going to bring this first part to a close. Our second interview with you will be in the next issue, probably focusing on your artworks and the stories behind the works.